Ponderables

[rabidsamfan]

If hobbits don't wear shoes or boots (except in rare instances) then why on earth does Sam sing about big Boots in the Troll Song, and why does he pack woolen hose?

And when Sam puts the Ring on and chases after the Orcs when they take Frodo, when does he take it off again? How many minutes/hours does Sam wear that thing, actually, and where was Gollum all that long time?

Why is it that I've never run across even one fic so far where Frodo starts out on the Quest properly hobbit-shaped, i.e. tubby in the tummy? And what happened to those rosy cheeks that Gandalf told Barliman about? Well, no I actually know the answers, don't I...

Comments

[jewelsong.livejournal.com]

And why does Tom Bombadil give the hobbits slippers to put on?

Re: Tom & his boots

[eykar.livejournal.com]

I always rather thought Tom was supposed to be one of the Big People. By the time Sam sings his troll-song, he has seen quite a few of those. Hobbit-hose may be more like leg-warmers.

As to your second set of questions, I'm stumped too, but I think that the answer to the third is that entirely too many fen think they couldn't love a fat hobbit, even if it was Frodo, so they refuse to be realistic.

[caraloup.livejournal.com]

If hobbits don't wear shoes or boots (except in rare instances) then why on earth does Sam sing about big Boots in the Troll Song

That's a very good question! The song as a whole is so peculiar, and totally contradicts the perception of Sam as your good-natured, optimistic next-door gardener. Of course there could be all kinds of pragmatic explanations for the boots in the song (seeing that some foot-protection is definitely required when kicking a troll ;), but why and how would Sam come up with such a pretty morbid scenario in the first place? (Uh, no, I can't answer that either. :)

And when Sam puts the Ring on and chases after the Orcs when they take Frodo, when does he take it off again? How many minutes/hours does Sam wear that thing, actually, and where was Gollum all that long time?

Gollum was off sneaking, I suppose... Sam has the Ring on when he faints in front of the Undergate, but when he regains consciousness, he's no longer wearing it. Then he puts it on once more as he climbs the pass, but he takes it off again as he takes his first step into Mordor.

As for the time that passes, there are some very peculiar time lapses throughout the Cirith Ungol events, but even so, Sam carried the Ring from March 13th (sometime before dusk) to the late evening hours of the 14th, or past-midnight hours of the 15th. That would make it something in between 28 hours at least, and 38 at most.

Why is it that I've never run across even one fic so far where Frodo starts out on the Quest properly hobbit-shaped, i.e. tubby in the tummy?

There are fics like that, you know. :) They're just pretty rare. So, since you didn't really want this question answered, may I recommend that you take a look at one wonderful story that also features Frodo's nicely rounded hobbit belly? Go here:

http://lightindarkplaces.luminousbeings.net/WTHK.htm

(This is Frayach's "What The Heart Knows", actually the second story in her "Let Evening Come" series, but it can be read on its own. I think you'd enjoy it. :)

[elycia.livejournal.com]

Re Sam and the Ring: I don't have TTT handy, but I was under the impression that he had to take the thing off if he wanted to see properly; while it had the benefit of improved hearing (as well as invisibility), it distorted vision and time-perception enough to make it a nuisance. I'll have to go look it up, now that you've piqued my curiosity.

[teasel.livejournal.com]

Another fic that sticks to canon about hobbit weight -- Merripestin's The Last Shreds of Autumn. It's set in Rivendell and Frodo has by this time been ill and lost weight, but one of the things Frodo appreciates about Sam is his hobbit, erm, solidity, and Frodo makes quite clear that by hobbit standards Sam looks darn good. Strong Adult slash, by the way, and a lovely fic, though the ending can be heartbreaking.

[gentlehobbit.livejournal.com]

*chuckle* I have had planned, for quite a while now, references to Frodo's rather hobbity girth in a fic I'm working on now. I too have wondered why he has always been described as "thin as a willow-wand" (to quote Frodo himself) in fanfic.

So I am delighted at your queries!

[cpsings4him.livejournal.com]

Very interesting discussion! I don't know about the Hobbit Boots or the Ring or any of that other stuff, but did have one comment about Frodo's figure. Does it count that I described various parts of him as "plump, pudgy and chubby" in my "The Early Adventures of Fwo and Unga Bee"? Granted, that was WAY pre-quest...but perhaps that one counts?


:)

Tom & his boots II

[eykar.livejournal.com]

According to the prologue of FoTR hobbits "seldom wore shoes. . . .the only craft little practiced among them was shoe-making." The same prologue states that the hobbits of the Marish "were rather large and heavy legged and they wore dwarf-boots in muddy weather." Therefore neither shoes nor boots were unknown, only uncommon.

Tolkien originally wrote the Troll Song entirely unrelated LoTR. According to The History of Middle Earth, Vol VI , The Return of the Shadow, Chapter 8, Arrival at Bree, it was originally meant to be sung at the inn at Bree by Bingo (whose place in later drafts was taken by Frodo.) It moved around the text a couple of times before settling down to being sung by Sam at Trollshaw.

Hose

[jane-somebody.livejournal.com]

Hi! Sorry to barge in, and to leave this very belated comment - I found your journal via a friend (Elwen) and keep reading it primarily for your wonderful drabbles, but I though I might put my tuppence-worth in here.

In England we do not, as a rule, use the word hose to mean tights/stockings/socks - in any case the word has a slightly archaic flavour. In this instance, I imagine it means something more like trousers or leggings, or possibly gaiters. Or indeed it can mean breeches or drawers - early twentieth century Englishmen would certainly think it essential to pack good woollen undergarments for any kind of hiking expedition. So here, at least, I don't think we need to worry about any kind of contradiction; I hope that helps!